Warsaw Pact photos - pre 1990 only

[RobertS]

...tails for Tonight...

[RobertS]

Some photos from an Ukrainian friend, who helped my work...
http://ggenn.moifoto.ru/21181/s1
He was PVO-pilot, the photographing on their airbases was really tricky(dangerous) in those times.
These Yak-28s were waiting for B-52s, F-111s...
In the Sovietunion a photo like this in 1979:
http://images-1.moifoto.ru/big/1/366/46 ... 1251812759
It could be the end of the career of a fighter-pilot....

[evhest]

Wow.... just wow.

[Stratofreighter]

Are these images going to be included in your book as well ?

[RobertS]

Are these images going to be included in your book as well ?

Other never before published photos from Gennady - and from other PVO guys - will publish in my book.
All photos in my coming book will "new", no pics. from the Net, no pics from other books or mags.
I think if I - or anybody else - upload(publish) a photo to the Net, that picture does not interesting in a book from that time - unfair to publish that in a book and sale...

[Iwan Bogels]

RobertS, hurry up with that book !!!!

I can't wait !!!!

Iwan (who has been dreweling by the sight of the Yak-28's)

[RobertS]

Iwan (who has been dreweling by the sight of the Yak-28's)

Fortunately there were few great guys on the "28", who took photos...

Here is the album of Igor Andreevitch Efimov:
http://vaul.ru/080/efimov_i.htm
He served in Hungary at Kunmadaras AB
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 5&t=h&z=14
in the period 1984-89 at 328.ograp. as squadron Co.

[Iwan Bogels]

Wow, even more shots of this rare bird. Do you know where these were taken ? Looking at the photos and seeing the MiG-25's too, as well as the country side and flightline, I would almost think it was at Werneuchen, DDR. Ir is this just wishful thinking ?

Keep 'em coming ! They're highly appreciated.

Cheers,
Iwan

PS: Do you own the 4 books of the "Sowjetische Fliegerkrafte Deutschland" too, as well as the book "Rote Platze" ?

[RobertS]

Do you know where these were taken ?

Photos in his album are from Aerodrom Kolomiya - аэродроме Коломыя:
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 5&t=h&z=14

[ehusmann]

The Yak-28, my very favourite bird of the Soviets, all time.... and in camo Just unbelievable....



Erwin

[RobertS]

Looking at the photos and seeing the MiG-25's too, as well as the country side and flightline, I would almost think it was at Werneuchen, DDR. Ir is this just wishful thinking ?

Here is something for you:
http://bellabs.ru/Fotab/R-931/R-931.html

[Iwan Bogels]

Ahhhhrrrgggg.......these photos bring tears to my eyes.....

[RobertS]

PS: Do you own the 4 books of the "Sowjetische Fliegerkrafte Deutschland" too, as well as the book "Rote Platze" ?

Yes, I have those books....but I am very disappointed with the matter...

For example - Author has basic problems to identify the MiG-21 subtypes - here on page 53.:



This is a MiG-21bis obviously.
And Damgartens 773.iap. was NOT MiG-21SM operator never !

Damgarten: MiG-21PFM > MiG-21SMT > MiG-21bis(a squadron up to 1986) > MiG-23MLD > MiG-29
MiG-23M detachment as "targets" for Navy + Il-28 target towing unit:

http://foto.mail.ru/mail/koa_pilot/671/

In this case if the Author check the Russian Net - he could get answers.
There were no necessity for personal relationship with people who served there in the 70s:

" "Замечаний к работе АТ нет." Подпись летчика - =Е.Подолянко= МиГ-21 в 70-х годах считался, в общем-то, освоенным типом самолета-истребителя. Лучшими модификациями считались МиГ-21см и МиГ-21бис и мы в истребительном авиационном полку, который базировался на аэродроме Дамгартен (ГСВГ) скептически отнеслись к тому, что наш полк переучивается на МиГ-21смт.
Хотя по своим маневренным характеристикам он не уступал указанным выше типам, но установленный сверху вдоль фюзеляжа дополнительный накладной топливный бак делал внешний вид самолета на земле как бы горбатым (в воздухе это практически было незаметно). Прозвали его летчики "чебурашкой".
Один, но значительный недостаток истребителя МиГ-21 заключался в его малом запасе топлива по сравнению с его "западными" противниками (F-104G, F-4C). И этот недостаток летчики-истребители ФРГ, американцы и шведы конечно знали.
Поэтому, когда мы выполняли задачу по постоянному прикрытию наших боевых кораблей в море в зоне Балтийских проливов, они открыто, с насмешкой, переходя на нашу радиочастоту, после 20-30 мин. барражирования напоминали нам: " ... Иван, посмотри на остаток, пора домой!" Они подстраивались на наш канал связи и на нем выдавали подобные реплики.
Командование, по докладам летчиков, выполнявших эту задачу, было информировано об этом. Естественно пришла мысль как бы поставить их на место. В нейтральных водах мы сопровождали свои корабли, а наши "коллеги" из НАТО как бы сопровождали нас. Висели над кораблями наша и их пары.
При этом вели себя спокойно летчики немцы и шведы, а американцы (особенно негры) вели себя в воздухе нагло. Ну как нагло? То сближались вплотную с нами, показывая непристойные жесты, картинки, то проносились через наш боевой порядок, иногда на ломаном русском языке даже сквернословили. В общем "веселили" нас и постоянно напоминали об остатке топлива.
В один прекрасный день, парой с ведомым взлетели с аэродрома Дамгартет и ушли в заданный район, нас там уже ждала "их" пара. Но мы были не на МиГ-21пфм, а на МиГ-21смт да еще с двумя подвесными топливными баками (2х490 л). Висим на высоте около 6000 м, они тоже. Проходит 30 минут, подошла другая их пара F-104 и тут напоминают, что и нам домой пора, но мы молча висим.
Барражируем уже больше часа, реплики в эфире продолжаются: "... мол, что решили до полной выработки летать, что ли?". Смотрим, подошла 3-я пара F-4, о чем-то меж собой поговорили, вторая пара ушла.
Прошло уже полтора часа, нас "поджимает" остаток (но аэродром Дамгартен ведь рядом и при посадке с рубежа нам вполне можно было отваливать с остатком, ну где-то 600-800 литров. Им то лететь значительно дольше чем нам, все происходило у наших берегов, а не у ихних.
Тогда американцы опять стали нас доставать: "...рус, а рус чем вас заправили?" Молчу. Прошло еще минут 12, американцы подошли вплотную, я им с улыбкой сказал: "Ну хорошо, мы уходим, погода портится... так вас растак!".
Помахал им рукой, врубили форсаж и левым боевым ушли в сторону своего аэродрома. Правда развернувшись градусов на 120, форсаж тут же выключили, обороты прибрали на "малый газ" и плавненько стали снижаться в расчетную точку. Так в этот день сопровождение наших моряков выполнили все вылетавшие летчики.
Через неделю разведка донесла, что "за бугром" переполох. Русские заправляются новым топливом. Вот тебе и СМТ, ну и "чебурашка".
Надо сказать прямо, я как летчик на этой модификации 21-го всегда чувствовал себя уверенно, не страшна любая погода и любое задание, свойственное истребителю. Кому помешает лишняя тонна керосина? "

Quick translate by:
http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_txt
...so-so...

" Observations to the work AT of." The signature of pilot - E.Podolyanko-MiG-21 in the 70's it was considered, in general, as the mastered type of fighter. As the best modifications they were considered MiG-21SM and MiG-21bis and we in the fighter regiment, which was based on the airfield Of Damgarten GSVG skeptically they related to the fact that our regiment is retrained on MiG-21SMT. Although according to its maneuverability characteristics it was not inferior to the above-indicated types, the additional additional fuel tank overmounted along the fuselage made the exterior view of aircraft on the earth as if humpbacked (in air this in effect it was unnoticeable). Called its pilots of "cheburashkoy". One, but a significant deficiency in the fighter MiG-21 consisted in its small fuel stock in comparison with its "zapadnymi" by enemies (F -104G, F -4C). And this deficiency the fighter pilots of the FRG, Americans and Swedes certainly knew. Therefore, when we accomplished task in a constant cover of our warships in the sea in the zone of Baltic straits, they are opened, with the mockery, passing to our radio frequency, after 20-30 min. the bombardments reminded us: " … Ivan, look to the remainder, time home! " They were adjusted slightly to our communication channel and on it issued similar remarks. Command, on the reports of pilots, who accomplished this task, was informed about this. The thought seemingly to place them on the place is naturally alien. In the neutral waters we accompanied our ships, and our of "kollegi" from NATO seemingly they accompanied us. They hang above the ships our and their pair. In this case behaved quietly the pilots Germans and Swedes, and Americans (especially negroes) behaved in air insolently. Well as it is insolent? First they converged close with us, showing obscene gestures, picture, then they were carried through our battle formation, sometimes in broken the Russian language even they used foul language. On the whole of "veselili" us they constantly resembled about the fuel remainder. During one excellent day, with pair with consent they took off from the airfield It (Damgarten) and they left into the assigned region, us there already waited "ikh" pair. But we were not on MiG-21PFM, but on MiG-21SMT on top of that with two external fuel tanks (2x490 l). We hang at the height of approximately 6000 m, they also. 30 minutes are passed, their another pair F-104, approached and they here recall that also to us home time, but we silently hang. We fly defensive patrol already more than hour, remarks in ether continue: " … it is said, that they did decide before the complete production to fly, that whether? ". We look, the 3rd pair F-4, approached, about by something between by itself they had a talk, the second pair left. Past already one-and-a-half hours, us " [podzhimaet]" remainder (but the airfield of Damgarten indeed next and with the landing from the boundary to us completely it was possible to push off with the remainder, well somewhere 600-800 liters. By it that to fly is considerably longer than to us, everything occurred on our shores, but not in [ikhnikh]. Then Americans again began to obtain us: " … Russian, and Russian how you did fill? " I keep silent. Past still minutes 12, Americans approached close, I said to them with the smile: " Well it is good, we depart, weather spoils… so you [rastak]! ". It waved to them by hand, they incised afterburner and by left combat they left to the side of their airfield. Pravda after being developed degrees to 120, they here turned off afterburner, revolutions put in order to " small [gaz]" and [Plavnenko] they began to be lowered into the calculation point. So during this day all departed pilots carried out tracking our seamen. The reconnaissance reported in the week, that " abroad " commotion. Russians are loaded with new fuel. Here to you and MiG-21SMT, well and "cheburashka". Necessary to say directly, I as pilot during this modification 21- GO always felt itself confidently, was not terrible any weather and any task, characteristic of fighter. Whom will prevent the excess ton of kerosene? "

There is the answer - 773.iap. converted from MiG-21PFM to MiG-21SMT

And so on:

" В 1973 в Дамгартене все бисы были серебристыми, в 75 г. получили из Горького 14 МиГ-21 бис последней серии (с РСБН и ракетами Р-13 и Р-60), которые были окрашены в серый матовый цвет(см. фото) В 76 г. два раза перегонял новые бисы из Горького для немцев в Пенемюнде, они были без окраски и опозвнавательных знаков (серебристые). На заводе в Горьком стояло десяток самолетов в серой матовой окраске. Вполне очевидно, что перекраска в камуфляж в основном выполнялась на местах, ведь сама кампания по перекраске интенсивно началась после преоразования ВА в ВВС округов. "



Obviously the many mistakes in Western observation reports in connection with Damgarten were because the lot of aircraft movements on exercises there.
They had occassional opportunities only to monitor the activites there.
The satellite images in the 70s were not as good as later, there were no chance to see the small differences between MiG-21SM vs bis. Maybe SMT vs SM,bis.

And from my viewpoint here is the main reason, why more easy to collect real data on Damgarten than on other 16.VA airbases in the 70s:
Damgarten was the place, where much more pilots and techs. were visitors on live-firing exercises than at any other Soviet AF airbases in Central-Europe.
Hungary, Poland, Czechoslovakia based fighter-units were regular visitors, sometimes non-Soviet WP units....
There are thousands of people around us who were there...

An example, movements from Tököl AB Hungary to Damgarten:



We are in 2009, and I am very tired, when I am reading the old, false "data" from old Western sources in a current book


Other same error in that book on page 24:



Obviously this airframe is unequivocally MiG-21SM on the photo...
What can I say ?
A memorial, many people were near, took photos of this aircraft...easy to check factory-number etc..

Maybe strong words:
These books are very useful with the data after 1991 - other question is, those infos and phots are available from other sources for everybody.
But for me obvious - Author took limited research pre-1990, especionally with pilots, techs who served in GSVG in the 60s, 70s....
He copied, repeated many false data from Western sources about the older years.

[RobertS]

Ahhhhrrrgggg.......these photos bring tears to my eyes.....

Werneuchen 1989:
http://foto.mail.ru/mail/koa_pilot/1312?page=1

[Iwan Bogels]

Hi Robert,

Werneuchen is where I shot my first "Red Star". A landing MiG-25U, code 02 Red. To me the MiG-25 had always been the ultimate "Red Star Aircraft" during the cold war. So imagine how I felt when my first photo of a Red Star was a MiG-25. I was extremely excited !!

Your photos bring back the fantastic memories that I have from "the Russian Period" (1990 - 1994). And although some of the books me not be 100% correct, I dream away by the photos that are shown. I am extremely glad to have visited the DDR about 15 times, and still I wish I would have gone there 10 times more often.

Please keep sharing your photos and let us know when the book is ready. I'll be most happy to buy it.

Cheers,
Iwan