MH17 from AMS to KUL down in Ukraine

[Stratofreighter]

http://news.airwise.com/story/view/1436918332.html

July 14, 2015

Australia has urged the United Nations Security Council to support the establishment of an international tribunal to prosecute those suspected of downing Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 in eastern Ukraine last year.

Malaysia, part of the 15-member council until 2016, distributed a draft resolution on the tribunal last week, which it hoped could be adopted later this month.
It is a joint proposal with Australia, the Netherlands, Belgium, and Ukraine.

[aviodromefriend]

Wasn't that vetoed by Russia already, or are they trying again?

Anyway, some of the found cargo seems to have been released by the authorities.

from https://mijnpostnl.mijnpostnl.nl/nieuws ... zorgd.aspx

De afgelopen weken hebben wij 600 poststukken die in vlucht MH17 zaten teruggebracht bij de afzenders. We hebben dit heel zorgvuldig gedaan, met een brief erbij en persoonlijk afgegeven. Gelukkig was er veel waardering voor onze werkwijze.

Hoe hebben we dit aangepakt?

Veel mensen wisten niet dat er post die zij hadden verstuurd in het vliegtuig zat. Post voor het buitenland wordt vaak via gewone passagiersvoertuigen vervoerd. De post was gevonden op de rampplek en onlangs door het onderzoeksteam vrijgegeven. We hebben ervoor gekozen alle post persoonlijk terug te brengen bij de afzender omdat het een beladen moment kan zijn als je deze post ontvangt. De afzenders konden kiezen of ze de post wilden terugnemen, alsnog laten opsturen of vernietigen. De meeste mensen hebben de post aangenomen.
Wie hebben de post bezorgd?

Teamleiders en procesmanagers van Productie en het Autobedrijf hebben de post bij particulieren en het midden- en kleinbedrijf gebracht. Accountmanagers hebben de post van grote klanten overhandigd. Henk Verstraten is een van de teamleiders van het Autobedrijf. ‘Het was een lange dag (06:30 - 23:00 uur), met veel kilometers (817 km) maar ik zou het zo weer doen. De reacties waren positief. Fijn dat ik een kleine bijdrage heb mogen leveren aan het correct afwerken van dit bijzondere werk. Ik ben trots op PostNL!’
Wat vonden de afzenders ervan?

Elina Kershof zat in het team dat de bezorging organiseerde: ‘Vaak waren mensen verbaasd dat we daar ineens stonden met post uit de MH17. Maar daarna was er veel waardering. Ik denk dat ze het heel erg op prijs stelden dat we deze speciale post met speciale aandacht behandelden.’

[Stratofreighter]

Interesting bit about the Dutch mail services indeed...

Also this:
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/15/polit ... h-ukraine/

New video of MH17 wreckage 08:29


(CNN)—It's been nearly one year since 298 people were killed after a commercial passenger plane broke up over the Ukraine.

U.S. officials concluded Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was struck by a missile and shot out of the sky.

A final report from investigators has yet to be released but CNN has learned new details from the draft investigative report for the July 17, 2014 incident.

Dutch accident investigators say, evidence points to pro-Russian rebels as being responsible for shooting down MH-17, according to a source who has seen the report.

According to two sources with knowledge of the investigation,
a draft of an investigative report authored by the Dutch Safety Board,
the lead agency in the investigation,
has been distributed for review to numerous agencies around the world including the National Transportation Safety Board, Federal Aviation Administration and Boeing.

The draft investigative report is several hundred pages long.
According to one source close to the investigation the draft report included the exact type of missile used to bring down MH17
and the trajectory of the missile.

Another source with knowledge of the report's details says it gives a minute by minute timeline of flight MH17.

This source also says not only does the draft report pinpoint where the missile was fired from it identifies who was in control of the territory and pins the downing of MH17 on the pro-Russian rebels.

According to both sources, the report also pins some blame on Malaysia Airlines for how its planes were dispatched that day.

The final report is expected to be competed and published in the first half of October 2015.

CNN has requested comment from the NTSB, FAA, Boeing and the Dutch Safety Board.

The Dutch safety board told CNN "we will not comment on the confidential draft final report"
and the NTSB said in an email
"The NTSB does not comment on an investigation that the Board is not the lead investigative agency."

[ehusmann]

Wasn't that vetoed by Russia already, or are they trying again?

It hasn't been voted on yet. However, Russia indeed already announced they will veto it and have said so again today. In other words 0 chance of the tribunal being put to work.

Erwin

[Stratofreighter]

http://onderzoeksraad.nl/en/onderzoek/2 ... meet#fasen

10 Aug 2015

International aviation investigators MH17 meet

This morning the team of international aviation investigators who investigate the cause of the crash of flight MH17, started a meeting that will last for a number of days.

During this meeting, lead by the Dutch Safety Board, the team will discuss the progress of the investigation and will visit air force base Gilze-Rijen to view the reconstruction of a part of the aircraft.

Last year, several meetings were held to discuss the progress of the investigation and to carry out further research. These meetings are part of the procedure for international aviation investigations laid down in the ICAO Convention.

The team of investigators, headed by the Dutch Safety Board, represent the countries which are involved in the MH17 investigation:
the Netherlands, Ukraine, Malaysia, Australia, the United States, the United Kingdom and the Russian Federation.

[Stratofreighter]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmaaI5o8rD0

MH17 Crash - Short version

The long version, English spoken, Russian subtitles:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGm00TdqirY

English, no subtitles:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDiLEyT9spI

And taken from
http://forum.scramble.nl/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=118538
the "Russian Reconstruction" by exploding a BUK missile warhead very near an Ilyushin IL-86 cockpit:
https://yadi.sk/i/40FlBCKejh8jc

[aviodromefriend]

For those that have a lot of time to read: http://cdn.onderzoeksraad.nl/documents/ ... ash-en.pdf

[Stratofreighter]

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-ukrai ... ld+News%29

| Fri Jun 3, 2016 11:52am EDT

Prosecutors conducting the criminal investigation into the downing of flight MH17 over eastern Ukraine two years ago said on Friday it was at "a very advanced stage" and that they would present their conclusions after the summer.

In a statement, prosecutors said they had made "several requests" for legal assistance from countries involved in the case, but were still waiting for information from Russia about the Buk missile that is believed to have brought down the Malaysian airliner, killing 298 people.

They said the final report would detail the nature of the weapon used
and the exact location from which it was fired.
The airliner crashed in territory held by Moscow-backed rebels against the Kiev government.

Russia cast its Security Council veto to block a motion to set up a United Nations-backed tribunal to try the case.

[Stratofreighter]

RT/Russia Today / Sputniknews ? : Don't bother...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disinformation

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eu ... story.html
/
http://nos.nl/artikel/2134541-rusland-o ... -vrij.html
/
http://www.volkskrant.nl/buitenland/rus ... ~a4383804/

https://themoscowtimes.com/news/russian ... data-55484

Ahead of Dutch MH17 Report, Russia Blames Ukraine (Again)

During the conference, the Defense Ministry put forth its own radar data —
which was allegedly discovered in recent weeks in the memory banks of a civilian radar station near the border with Ukraine — purportedly showing MH17 could not have been shot down from the separatist side,
as has been alleged.

The new Russian account completely dropped allegations of Ukrainian Su-25 fighter jets in the area.

An investigation into the culprit by the Dutch government is expected to be released on Sept. 28.

The issue of who shot down MH17 has become one of major geopolitical significance, and a point of key contention between Russia and the West over Moscow's role in the ongoing Ukrainian crisis.
Each side has offered multiple theories to suit their respective narratives.

The core of Almaz-Antey's claim rested on the shrapnel pattern found in the damaged metal hull of MH17.

The company's claim both contradicted findings presented at a press conference three month's earlier, and the findings of the Dutch report.

[Stratofreighter]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/29/world ... IFTTT&_r=0

SEPT. 28, 2016

UNITED NATIONS — A Dutch-led investigation has concluded that the powerful surface-to-air missile system that was used to shoot down a Malaysia Airlines plane over Ukraine two years ago, killing all 298 on board,
was trucked in from Russia at the request of Russian-backed separatists
and returned to Russia the same night.

The report largely confirmed the already widely documented Russian government role not only in the deployment of the missile system, called a Buk, or SA-11,
but the subsequent cover up, which continues to this day.

The report by a team of prosecutors from the Netherlands, Australia, Belgium, Malaysia and Ukraine was significant for applying standards of evidence admissible in court,
while still building a case directly implicating Russia,
and is likely to open a long diplomatic and legal struggle over the tragedy.

With meticulous detail, working with cellphone records, social media, witness accounts and other evidence, Dutch prosecutors traced Russia’s role in deploying the missile system into Ukraine and its attempt to cover its tracks after the disaster.

The inquiry did not name individual culprits and stopped short of saying that Russian soldiers were involved.

A summary of the findings, obtained by The New York Times, was to be released at a news conference in The Hague on Wednesday.

The inquiry represents the most detailed investigation to date of the attack on Malaysia Airlines Flight 17, a Boeing 777 flying to Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia’s capital, from Amsterdam.

In Moscow on Wednesday, in anticipation of the release, President Vladimir V. Putin’s spokesman, Dmitri S. Peskov, issued a statement to reporters decrying “speculation” about the plane but it did not refer specifically to the report.

[pluggie]

Halve the world by now doesn't believe anything anymore:

Previous evidence reported as impact position and Field position of the Buk reported by Dutch authorities and US authorities were denounced as "false" by the JIT team.
Wat een poppekast.

... So the Ukranians DID factually shoot it down?

[hammarö]

Many know what happened with the MH17.
But Russia are involved in western political movements.

Russian call their actions Maskirovka.
Means delay and cheat.
Were is books about it.

Just now it is critical because of the US elections, means higher political and military readiness.

[hammarö]

Link to very accurate information at bellingcat.

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and- ... onference/

[Stratofreighter]

http://nos.nl/artikel/2144882-justitie- ... oeken.html
/
https://translate.google.com/translate? ... edit-text=

Internationaal Strafhof Den Haag.

Justice Ukraine: Criminal Court should investigate crimes MH17
 Today, 18:21

Justice in Ukraine want the International Criminal Court in The Hague, the downing of flight MH17 will investigate. That says Prosecutor Yuriy Lutsenko against the NIS.

He believes that the "ideal decision" and other options are "less effective".

Loetsenko sees the disaster with Malaysian Airlines device as a war crime that should be prosecuted in an international context.

"The whole world knows that the Russian rocket was the MH17 has knocked down.

The launch spot, occupied territory, is known.

But Russia says such information is not true.

Such a cynical lie only confirms the need for these war crimes at the international level to prosecute.

the ideal decision is that the ICC's decision to determine whether it has jurisdiction to do so, "said the attorney General.


The ICC is a permanent criminal court designed to prosecute individuals suspected of war crimes, genocide and crimes against humanity.
Trial by the ICC is not immediately apparent according to international law professor Geert-Jan Knoops.

Thus, a high burden of proof required:
"There must be personal responsibility must You are not designated by a group or battalion You must specify exactly who you suspect, and in this case you must also specify the command line:...
Who had to say and decided to fire a missile. "

There are also procedural and substantive obstacles, said Knoops earlier against the NIS .

In addition, the three countries closely involved - Ukraine, Russia and Malaysia - no treaty states.
By recognizing the jurisdiction of the ICC, has Ukraine threshold be made slightly lower.

extradite suspects

Other possibilities for prosecuting its national courts, a self-created tribunal or a variant Lockerbie.

But any prosecution mechanism is chosen, there remains a big problem, says Knoops.

"In almost all cases requires voluntary cooperation of Russia.
And that seems currently unlikely."
Russia has already indicated to extradite suspects several times.


Earlier, Ukraine asked the ICC to investigate possible abuses that took place that year under the regime of ousted President Viktor Yanukovych, in the Crimea and eastern Ukraine.

Last week, the ICC labeled the conflict in eastern Ukraine into an international conflict between Russia and Ukraine.

Then President Putin decided to withdraw Russia's signing of the founding treaty of the ICC.

[Stratofreighter]

http://www.ruaviation.com/news/2017/1/31/8008/

Tuesday January 31, 2017 22:15 MSK

Russian Federal Air Transport Agency Rosaviatsia denied Dutch claims of Russia's radar data on MH17 crash allegedly violating international requirements.

Rosaviatsia also stated that Russia has provided the Netherlands with MH17 crash primary radar data three months ago and since has not received any requests for help of Russian experts to decode the data.

"To date, we have received no requests from the Dutch side to involve our experts in decoding the primary radar data," Rosaviatsia Deputy Chief Oleg Storchevoy told reporters.

Media reports suggested on Sunday that Dutch investigators failed to decode information on the MH17 crash in eastern Ukraine provided by Russia last fall.

"There are no international requirements concerning such information and the way it is recorded," Storchevoy said.

He also voiced surprise that the Netherlands "cannot decode our [Russia's] data, with this fact being stated in media, but not making Russia aware of it."

Issues the Dutch-led Joint Investigation Team (JIT) is experiencing in decoding the MH17 crash radar data could have been resolved immediately through joint work with Russian experts, the Russian air transport agency said.

"The ICAO recommends to involve specialists, developers of equipment if an investigation takes place to decode the information and obtain objective data.
The fact that it took the Dutch side took more than three months to provide such information is puzzling.
Our data have been transferred last year. This is a purely technical matter, which can be immediately solved via cooperation."