F-35 Lightning II developments

[Coati]

but appearently the 4th/5th generation planes can do tricks others can't..

The million (or in this case multiple billion) dollar question is: For how long? It will be be at least 10 years before the JSF can be operational in significant numbers. By then the Russian and Chinese radar systems will be painfully ably to deal with present day stealth techniques. So the bonus we pay now, might be better spent on a larger number of other fighters.

It's not only about stealth capabilities. AFAIK it is a wide range of technology put in the new 5th Gen a/c: the fusion capabilities of (target)information, the AESA radar system, the fact that they don't have to aim at a target, 360° view etc etc does the trick.

Remember the F-15 was also stuffed with a lot of new technology. Why did the US invest in that aircraft? Well obviously to dominate the sky with the most advanced fighter of the previous decades. Was it obsolete in a few years? I don't think so. But if you had asked back then: what do you prefer: 1 Eagle or 4 Phantoms, the answer would have been the same as now: go for the Eagle.

An interesting question is why China and Russia are also trying to develop stealth aircraft, when the technology is obsolete anyway. These wild claims of advanced Russian and Chinese A/D systems are not really found in actual hardware on the market. The predictions that such systems will be developed is not the same as actually having developed and deployed these systems. Simple: they are not (yet) there), and if they are there, they will probably be very expensive. And a ground system is one thing, but how do they want to put those systems in A2A systems? Because to shoot down a 5th gen aircraft with an interceptor, the interceptor must be able to lock the aircraft in the first place.

[Wildpicture]

It's not only about stealth capabilities. AFAIK it is a wide range of technology put in the new 5th Gen a/c: the fusion capabilities of (target)information, the AESA radar system, the fact that they don't have to aim at a target, 360° view etc etc does the trick.

I agree with you on that. But the thing is that all the other technology can also be built into another airframe like a F15, F16, F18 or Gripen. The original F16 we bought in the 70-ties is a technologically completely different aircraft from what we fly now. All the systems and electronics have changed. Still the airframe itself keeps performing. It is always mentioned that we could built the new technology into a F15/F16/F18 but we would loose the stealth capability. My point is, that if we loose that advantage anyway, why not use other airframes? Many reports seem to indicate that purely as a fighter plane (flight characteristics), all these aircraft perform better than a JSF. A generation ago with the F15/F16/F18 compared to F4, F104 that was very different.

[Coati]

I go with you to a certain point. With updated, MLU etc you can get more out of older gen aircraft. But at a certain point, an aircraft type is reaching its limit with updates. The airframe design is outdate, there is no internal space to stow additional electronic sytems and the basic design and interior remains the same. Then it is benefitial to design a new aircraft with all equipment developed and to be developed, instead of patching up an older aircraft. Also the new gen fighter engines F119, F135 will be more powerful and reliable. Things like thrust vectoring (F-22) or the new gen engines can't be build into an older aircraft and have to be an inegral part of a design.

By the way: I highly doubt the rumours that a JSF is outperformed by older aircraft. As far as I have seen there are only cases of selected picking of a certain characteristic (like speed) and compare that to one of the older aircraft around. I know with the speed part that the comparison was not done right (a clean F-16 or F-18 comparing with the F-35 required speed of Mach 1.6 or something like that), while F-16s or F-18s never will fly in a cvlean configuration in combat...

The DoD has described into detail what the performance of the F-22 and F-35 has to be, it would be rather strange if they require a plane that is inferior to the types it has to replace. So no logic here I guess.

But we will see...

[Piet Luijken]

Some news again:


Two Lockheed Martin F-35Bs Ferried To Eglin, Marking 25th DOD Delivery
FORT WORTH, Texas, May 10, 2012 – Two Lockheed Martin [NYSE: LMT] F-35B short takeoff/vertical landing (STOVL) production aircraft were ferried to Eglin Air Force Base, Fla., today, marking the 24th and 25th F-35 deliveries to the Department of Defense. The 5th Generation multirole fighter jets were delivered to the United States Marine Corps and are now assigned to the 2nd Marine Aircraft Wing’s Marine Fighter/Attack Squadron 501 residing with the host 33d Fighter Wing.
U.S. Marine Corps pilots Maj. Joseph Bachmann and Lt. Col. Matt Kelly piloted the aircraft, known as BF-9 and BF-10 respectively, which departed Naval Air Station Fort Worth Joint Reserve Base, Texas at 1:26 p.m. and 1:42 p.m. CDT for an approximate 90-minute flight to Florida’s Emerald Coast. The jets became the 10th and 11th F-35s to join Eglin’s fleet. Both jets will be used for pilot and maintainer training at the F-35 Integrated Training Center there.  
One additional STOVL production jet, BF-11, will join the fleet at Eglin in the coming days. All three jets were formally accepted by the U.S. Defense Contract Management Agency (DCMA) on behalf of the Marine Corps with the signing of Department of Defense Form 250 (DD-250). BF-9 and BF-10 were accepted May 4 while BF-11 was accepted May 5. Prior to acceptance, the three F-35Bs underwent a series of company and government checkout flights at Lockheed Martin’s F-35 production facility in Fort Worth, Texas.
The F-35 Lightning II is a 5th Generation fighter, combining advanced stealth with fighter speed and agility, fully fused sensor information, network-enabled operations and advanced sustainment. Three distinct variants of the F-35 will replace the A-10 and F-16 for the U.S. Air Force, the F/A-18 for the U.S. Navy, the F/A-18 and AV-8B Harrier for the U.S. Marine Corps, and a variety of fighters for at least nine other countries.
Headquartered in Bethesda, Md., Lockheed Martin is a global security and aerospace company that employs about 123,000 people worldwide and is principally engaged in the research, design, development, manufacture, integration and sustainment of advanced technology systems, products and services. The Corporation's net sales for 2011 were $46.5 billion.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[Piet Luijken]

Seen at LMTAS on 8 May 2012:
F-35B ZM135, 168060/VM-04, 168062/VM-06 and 168310/VM-09

Flying on 9 May 2012:
168310/VM-09

[Coati]

Other F-35 news:

The UK has decided to reverse the decision to switch to F-35C aircraft, and are back to their original plan to operate F-35B aircraft from the two new carriers, because costs of modifications (catapult etc) were spinning out of control.

Also mentioned was that the helmet problem seems to be fixed.

[Richard from Rotterdam]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-18008171

Read this story for more info on the UK U-turn. Interestingly a couple of months ago some US Navy related defence parties stated that the cost of refitting the British carriers with cat-trap installations could be done by them for little more than 300 million pounds...

[Richard from Rotterdam]

Haven't read anything about this yet, but according to Dutch newspaper Trouw the Fort Worth factory has come to a standstill due to a general workers strike, that started on April 23d. Apparently LM is keeping very quiet about the strike that has yet to see an end. Workers are angry about attempts from LM to cut in the salaries and workers' rights.

The union representatives says that management doesn't want to give in to demands (yet) and that it may be quite a while until production will resume.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[tally]

Perhaps some delays can be expected. However typically LMTAS resolves the issue by using direct labor. Not possitive if that could be the resolution here as well. Will do some questioning to find out. It is funny to see workers along the picket line though.

However currently aircraft on the flightline, which are quite a few, are being worked on and regularly flown.

[Coati]

BF-11 (an USMC F-35B) was delivered to Eglin AFB yesterday, making this the 12th jet for the 33 FW.

[tally]

Well. Missed that one.

Today two first flights for F-35A's AF-17 and AF-18. These were resp 09-5004/OT "31 TES" and 09-5005/OT. Both flew as Lightning 11.

[Coati]

Missed a few first flights:
AF-16 f/f on the 3rd of May
BF-12 on the 30th of March

Right now 35 F-35s aircraft are flying:
For testing: 6 F-35A at Edwards and 5 F-35B plus 3 F-35C at PAX
For training: 6 F-35A and 6 F-35B at Eglin
Awaiting delivery at Fort Worth after first flights 6 F-35A and 3 F-35B

Only 7 LRIP-3 aircraft still have to fly (including the KLu aircraft), then we can expect the first of 21 LRIP-4 aircraft.

[Coati]

First F-35B flight from Eglin was conducted today. The F-35As have flown 47 sorties till now from Eglin, all so called orientation flights. Real training is about to start this summer to work towards IOC.

[Rockville]

Apparently the number of aircraft for the RNLAF has been reduced, which also results in the closure of EHLW.
http://www.jsfnieuws.nl/?p=804

[Wildpicture]

Closing Leeuwarden would be a very bad idea. Even with a lower number of aircraft, we do need a second MOB. Just in case.....