EHAM 05-12-15 Hungarian AF C-17 discussion

[Raptor16]

It doesn't belong to the Hungarian Air Force, its owned and operated by the NATO.

[Numbercruncher]

It doesn't belong to the Hungarian Air Force, its owned and operated by the NATO.

What's your point? It sports Hungarian marks, and seems to adhere to the Hungarian serial system rather than the NATO serial system. Ownership of aircraft at this day and age seems like a rather grey area, even for the military (e.g. those RAF Voyagers), and operators have been grey for decades, so the decision to file these aircraft under Hungary seems just as valid as filing them under NATO.

You decide, but not for me...

Grtz,

Robert W

[nellis6]

In actual fact they are not owned by Hungarian Air Force or NATO. They are Strategic Airlift Capability (SAC, as on vertical fin), which includes some non-NATO partners, Also, not all NATO members are involved in operating the aircraft. Countries involved are ten NATO nations (Bulgaria, Estonia, Hungary, Lithuania, the Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Romania, Slovenia and the United States) and two Partnership for Peace (PfP) nations (Finland and Sweden).

[Stratofreighter]

What would Luxembourg markings look like Geilenkirchen's AWACS aircraft do not really sport them...

Oh well, we will see when Luxembourg finally gets its' own solitary Airbus A400M ...

[pjotrtje]

It's got Hungarian markings, so no matter where the funds came from: it's a Hungarian aircraft. Just like the Luxembourg markings on the E-3As at Geilenkirchen...

[TF-104G]

The aircraft have clear Hungarian Air Force markings, typical Hungarian mil "roundel".
When you write down civil aircraft, and you saw a plane in KLM colours, so it´s KLM for you and not from a Leasing Company or Bank.

[nellis6]

Argue what you like, they are not Hungarian Air Force. They are not owned by HAF and they are not operated by HAF. They wear HAF marks simply because they are based at Papa, Hungary.

From the SAC website a quote "The aircraft operate out of Pápa Air Base in Hungary. The first aircraft was delivered in July 2009 with the second and third aircraft following in September and October 2009, respectively. The aircraft are operated by multinational aircrews under the command of a multinational military structure – the Heavy Airlift Wing (HAW). The HAW is manned by personnel from all participating nations".

Where does it mention they are owned or operated by HAF? Answer, nowhere!

[Gerard]

....... pretty useless discussion

[Piet Luijken]

C-17A
The three C-17 transport planes are registered in
Hungary and have Hungarian Air Force markings on
them.

from http://www.honvedelem.hu/container/file ... igures.pdf

NATO is not a country so it has to be registrated somewhere!

[ehusmann]

Where does it mention they are owned or operated by HAF? Answer, nowhere!

And of course, there is absolutely no other example anywhere in de world (or in history) where aircraft were not owned nor operated by the air arm that deployed them.

Glad you are so certain of the thruth, most others will probably take a look at the actual markings that the aircraft carry.

Erwin

[Ajaxfever]

Where does it mention they are owned or operated by HAF? Answer, nowhere!

And of course, there is absolutely no other example anywhere in de world (or in history) where aircraft were not owned nor operated by the air arm that deployed them.

Glad you are so certain of the thruth, most others will probably take a look at the actual markings that the aircraft carry.

Erwin

it carries HAF markings so 100% Hungarian AF for me too.

Peter

[BirdieBarty]

It's definitely a Hungarian. End of discussion-Topic can be closed!
Pffff.. unbelieveble we make a topic of this. So typically Dutch. Let me guess, the guy who talks the most is it this bla bla is it that blabla
Let me guess... HE WASN'T even on site with his big MM camera

[Piet Luijken]

well, what if a Argentinian Bell helicopters operates in Cyprus with full UN titles?

[Agfaritsrats]

Where does it mention they are owned or operated by HAF? Answer, nowhere!

And of course, there is absolutely no other example anywhere in de world (or in history) where aircraft were not owned nor operated by the air arm that deployed them.

Glad you are so certain of the thruth, most others will probably take a look at the actual markings that the aircraft carry.

Erwin

That last remarks, "you are so certain of the thruth", djzee, coming from you, that is something of an eye-opener. Not in the least for yourself, cause you never seem to be in doubt or leave room for other opions, angles or whatever. Call them the undisputed truhts, according to ehusmann....... tssss Go write a book about it.

To everyone: please enjoy your hobby! As for the question: like to add one. Who pays taxes for them (cause then that is the 'owner'!) (or is it?)

Anyway: you could alter denoting the aircraft every time you see one of these crates, and - or choose to do it the way you like best.

Hung. AF
Hung. AF / NATO
HAW / Hung. AF
Multinational HAW, rem. Hung. AF markings
NATO / HAW
NATO / HAW (rem. Hung. AF markings)
.....
I do not mind which one you prefer. Have a ball.

[nellis6]

With all due respect to everyone else and their opinions, I am just quoting from official sources. Comments about it being Hungarian Air Force are peoples opinions, not factual information. Personally you can say it is whatever you like, I do not mean to disrespect anyone or tell anyone they are stupid. I just tried to educate in the nicest possible way, sadly some people seem to think I am telling them they are dumb. That is not the case and I apologise if people are offended. As for the comment about typical Dutch, I'm actually English. Doei!