Luchtmachtdagen/Airforcedays 14/15 June 2013 Volkel Opinions

[Slijfie]

Thanks Erwin. I missed both helicopters completely and did not see them arrive. Unfortunatly. I saw in the live stream that the NH90 is in the static show now.

[KIER]

="SlijfieTo be honest, I think NavyGM has some good points. Some of the most interesting aircraft were on the wrong side of the base,

You're right Rob. But at (almost) every airshow the flying aircraft are positioned at other places. And he have some good points, but we just have to deal with it. And considering that at the last Spottersdays at Volkel the only part for spotters was the grandstand. We now had 400 meters more.

The biggest factor to make it good or bad is ALWAYS in hands of air traffic control of the base. For example RIAT ; 15 years back the amount of participating aircraft was 200%-300% higher , and even now airtraffic control is not in the possibility to let all aircraft fly or taxi in front of the aviation enthausiasts.

Another two pennies.


Kier

[Betman]

@navyGM Three Alouettes nearby the C-130/C-17 were very good for photos.
I guess they made (all three in total) 20 flights so good shots was no problem.
Even the NH90 and Cougar dropped some people in front of the Alouettes.

[PilotoRico]

="SlijfieTo be honest, I think NavyGM has some good points. Some of the most interesting aircraft were on the wrong side of the base,

You're right Rob. But at (almost) every airshow the flying aircraft are positioned at other places. And he have some good points, but we just have to deal with it. And considering that at the last Spottersdays at Volkel the only part for spotters was the grandstand. We now had 400 meters more.

The biggest factor to make it good or bad is ALWAYS in hands of air traffic control of the base. For example RIAT ; 15 years back the amount of participating aircraft was 200%-300% higher , and even now airtraffic control is not in the possibility to let all aircraft fly or taxi in front of the aviation enthausiasts.

Another two pennies.


Kier

Here we go again..... Open Days are not for aviation enthusiasts.... they are for all kind of people and public. "Spotterdagen" are for aviation enthusiasts..... try to remember this.

Cheers

[janneman36]

="SlijfieTo be honest, I think NavyGM has some good points. Some of the most interesting aircraft were on the wrong side of the base,

You're right Rob. But at (almost) every airshow the flying aircraft are positioned at other places. And he have some good points, but we just have to deal with it. And considering that at the last Spottersdays at Volkel the only part for spotters was the grandstand. We now had 400 meters more.

The biggest factor to make it good or bad is ALWAYS in hands of air traffic control of the base. For example RIAT ; 15 years back the amount of participating aircraft was 200%-300% higher , and even now airtraffic control is not in the possibility to let all aircraft fly or taxi in front of the aviation enthausiasts.

Another two pennies.


Kier

'

The biggest factor isn't air traffic control at the base but at the men who plan the show and the regulations they have to follow, i for instance think that it was a safety wise dicision for not taxiing the aircraft in front of the public due to the minimal room they had.
Also some active planes where towed to the active ramp of the field instead.
And we also can't spent as much nowadays anymore (200% or 400% less i think)
Safety can fail because of two pennies...(don't get me wrong i also would have liked a smooky startup of a B25 in front of me)
Anyway i have still enough photo's taken the past days to make it worth coming.
Regards,

Jan

[Mad Viper]

It were some nice days. I agree a bit about the rare aircraft being put in the other site of the field unfortunately, Like why two PC-12's but only one on static. but I'm not gonna make a fuss about it, still liked the static very much. Big plus about the static in front of the display, which is not said much, is the fact that you can mix flying with static on your photos. That's the only thing I like at such a setting. It was said before, even it was 100 years of Military aviation, don't expect much. Well I didn't and I was surprised by some things. Like the PC-7 fly-by, that was a long time ago that those guys flew at such days. But still I missed a lot of the 100 years theme that really showed the theme. Even the historic block was for some a good time to take a break, to bad that guys didn't go all out, some short displays and that's it. But the new displays this years were incredible. RAMEX was awesome, Viggen was incredible, Airpower demo was great in the air, stopped shooting the F-16 at the beginning cause that was an impossible task

Other thing I didn't like were the loudspeakers, yes its a common problem about the placement for shooting photos. But the placement also gives problems for information announcements in my opinion. A lot of the info wasn't audible from the rear of the field. That's good if you hate the commentators (which really need to be sent with retirement with there faults). But I guess that people in the rear also want to hear what is going on. Also the volume could be better handled, cause it was very high at the displayline.

And there was some problems with the parking. A friend of mine got stuck in traffic at 8 O'Clock in the morning, and was on base at 12!? I was parked at P1, left at 16.00 from the base to be ahead of the big crowd, but that was a farce. Got in the car around 16.15, travelled 100 meters and stood there for some 2,5 hours at P1. Around 19.00 there was finally some action, such that the rate of cars leaving the parking increased. But if it wasn't some bad behaviour like jumping the queue, I would stood there for another 30 till 60 minutes, yeah I know I'm a bad person and should be banned for jumping the queue, but I really had it with the waiting, me and others too. I know, now people are gonna say, you should come by bus or bike, yeah you're right, perhaps taking the bus at Uden was easier, but still. An hour or 1.5 hour waiting to leave the parking is acceptable by me, cause you know that it would be busy, but 3 hours?

Big compliment to United, I really liked some of the videos on the screen. Wondered how the DVD would look like of they did one. The best part? Seeing how the Italian commentator was in his element during the Frecce Display, that guy really made my day with his commentating.

And their were some small things non-aviation related stuff that could be better, but this is not the podium to mention them. Now on to enjoying the photos.

[11E]

That's good if you hate the commentators (which really need to be sent with retirement with there faults).

I loved the commentator from Frecce Tricolore, it sounded like Captain Alberto Bertorelli from Allo Allo. I first thought it was a joke from a Dutch commentator

[navygm]

stay at home or at least stay away from the spottersday

Don't go next time.

Hehe, you've got to love the hospitality of the Dutch

Anyway, @navygm, thank you for visiting out friendly little country. Unfortunately, we spotters, do have to understand that the airshow is not primarily focussed at spotters, but at recruitement and showing the main public where their money is going. Therefore, we don't get everything we want. In my opinion many hints and tips from the spotters community are already taken into account (for example the spottersday itself), but in the end it will never be perfect for us. To me as a numbercruncher it was already much, much better than previous years. You are disappointed some planes were on the far side, I was extremely happy that everything at least was visible. In previous years I missed a number of planes simply because they were parked hidden from sight.

So, please understand it will not be perfect for us, but also try to enjoy the things that you do get. Like 2 Corsairs, An-2 and 3 Fitters

Erwin

I think this was an honest comment that I should reply on...
I really enjoyed the hospitality of the dutch as I met some nice people and friendly! From what I always note even from this forum, the dutch spotters are very keen on aviation and I presumed that when doing an airshow of this quality alot of involvement of spotting clubs would be present. But anyway it could havent been possible to do a perfect airshow but maybe these points will be read from those organizers etc... and the next one will be even better, because from these points you improve, without feedback from others you get to nowhere.

Anyway this was our first time in the netherlands and we will be back as I'm enjoying this country.

[navygm]

KIER schreef:
stay at home or at least stay away from the spottersday

evhest schreef:
Don't go next time.

Hehe, you've got to love the hospitality of the Dutch

To be honest, I think NavyGM has some good points. Some of the most interesting aircraft were on the wrong side of the base, like the Viggen, spare Su-22 and the Czech C295. Imagine the Viggen being serviced and taxiing from the static side! That would have been a sight. But I'm sure the foreign crews wanted this the way it was.

What bothered me a little was that no NH90 was displayed or even on the static side (one left in the morning from the other side). Thus making this '100 years of military aviation' a KLu-party. But I enjoyed the show on Friday - the Estonian An-2 alone making it all worthwhile.

I fully agree with the above...
at least I have Estonian An-2 which I can print large posters of it as it was perfect!

[ehusmann]

That's good if you hate the commentators (which really need to be sent with retirement with there faults).

I loved the commentator from Frecce Tricolore, it sounded like Captain Alberto Bertorelli from Allo Allo. I first thought it was a joke from a Dutch commentator

On Friday the Patrouille de Suisse commentator announced that they would paint the Swiss flag in de Norwegian skies. I looked around to see if I was the only one who noticed that..... I think I was...

Erwin

[Stranger]

i for instance think that it was a safety wise dicision for not taxiing the aircraft in front of the public due to the minimal room they had. Also some active planes where towed to the active ramp of the field instead.

Was this Saturday only? On Friday all kinds of planes taxied from the static line to the runway and military personnel made it possible by stopping cars and people and allowing the planes to taxi without hitting anyone or anything.

As a result planes like the F-4F Phantom II, the SB LIM-2, the Fouga Magister and the demo F-16, J-015, just to name a few, taxied to/from the runway right in front of the spectators. The only ones that were towed, as far as I have seen, on Friday were the B-25 and the Spitfire.

Re comments on people getting stuck in parking lots and on buses. Friday was also a good day to go there using public transportation. Bus was waiting at Oss station and we only lost 10 minutes because the driver decided to drive into Uden instead of going south on the Industrielaan. On my way back after the show ended there were several buses waiting, no queues and some 30 minutes after I had left the airbase I was back in Oss.

Given it was some 10 years since my last visit to a Dutch air show due to other commitments and seeing all negative comments in recent years re transportation I was positively surprised. Quality and quantity of participating aircraft were (of course) better in the past, but given budget restrictions all around the world I think the boys and girls at Volkel did a great job !

[Stranger]

One thing I do agree with...commentator quality (or the lack of it).

- They acted as if they knew everything, yet made mistakes that were inexplicable. (wrong names for planes, wrong explanations or simply forgot things (MiG-23 Flogger for swept wing aircraft)
- Strange comments totally unrelated to what was happening in the air, perhaps meant to be funny.
- Talking to each other and to other with the microphone open

[11E]

On Friday the Patrouille de Suisse commentator announced that they would paint the Swiss flag in de Norwegian skies. I looked around to see if I was the only one who noticed that..... I think I was...

Erwin

That would be fine by me, no euro and more natural resources like oil and gas. But I didn't notice the comment..

[K2G]

My yearly highlights are the comments on this forum after the show !!
Can't wait for RIAT next month (-:

[Nilson]

My yearly highlights are the comments on this forum after the show !!
Can't wait for RIAT next month (-:

+1

( Do not forget Wittmund )

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